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Rank: Pro Groups: Joined: 24/08/2009 Posts: 48,827 Points: -13,348
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If you want a good bond then remove the paint from the tops of the gun support beams; what you dont want is one of the supports mounted to it coming loose when the dummy barrels are inserted, where you may then be unable to gain access to re-glue the support.
You should complete the planking prior to where the magazine says to install the gun support beams, the planking provides rigidity to the hull, adding the support beams too soon may create a frame movement problem which is then set.
The mounting holes for the dummy guns are being drilled central to the port openings, the additional gun support pieces are there to take into account of end to end deck camber, which in turn means that some of the mounting holes will be slightly higher than those in the full gun mount beam, but will look okay, and hence why an additional piece is added, otherwise there would be nothing to drill into.
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Rank: Elite Groups: Unapproved
Joined: 24/05/2010 Posts: 1,761 Points: 5,351 Location: London & Greece
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Perfect response, thanks and will do.
You may want to amend your diary as it looks to me like the tops are painted. It would be good to make it unambiguous for those coming up behind me.
I guess it's too late the change the magazine.
John
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Rank: Pro Groups: Joined: 24/08/2009 Posts: 48,827 Points: -13,348
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There's nothing to change in the magazine as the tops are unpainted, mine we're painted as it was not apparent at the time that additional gun supports were being added for additional height, where any painted area's of the tops was then sanded for the securing of the additional gun supports, ultimately it depends on what sort of glue is used for the best fix
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Rank: Elite Groups: Unapproved
Joined: 24/05/2010 Posts: 1,761 Points: 5,351 Location: London & Greece
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Just thought it might be worth making it abundantly clear for us novices, there's so much to take in it's easy to miss something.
No criticism intended.
John
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Rank: Vice-Master Groups: Registered
Joined: 06/06/2010 Posts: 566 Points: 1,657 Location: UK
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Hi,
Looking good I'm at a similar point to yourself, but have been too shy to add pics!
Noticed your post about not using pins, have you tried the bulldog clip method?
Remove the silver lever portion from 1 clip and insert in the black sprung portion so that the rounded end protrudes one side, you can then clamp onto the ribs & the rounded end holds the plank against rib. Can also add pressure in a vertical plane to squeeze planks together but this does depend on plank to deck level.
I've found this method very useful but must add not my idea, stole/borrowed it from someone else on here!
Keep up the great work.
Wilfy
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Rank: Elite Groups: Unapproved
Joined: 24/05/2010 Posts: 1,761 Points: 5,351 Location: London & Greece
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Hi Wilfy
Thanks for the comments, they are always appreciated.
Yes I bought a load of those clips but found they weren't as tight as the pins. I thought it was important that the planks sat snugly on the ribs and the BD's didn't seem to provide enough pressure. Also I couldn't use them on the ribs just below the desk as I had fitted mine as the instructions had described.
However you do need to be careful with the pins as they can split the ribs. I found it works better if you screw them in slowly. I am sure I will use the clips again later on the lower hull though.
John
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Rank: Elite Groups: Unapproved
Joined: 24/05/2010 Posts: 1,761 Points: 5,351 Location: London & Greece
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OK so on to the next. I used the gauge to mark out the middle row of gun ports but of course the line is angled at the stern and bows. I remember we had to the the ports level to the waterline so I presume these lines are not helpful. Should I just measure 31mm to the centre of the gun port and make a square, level hole from there? John
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Rank: Elite Groups: Unapproved
Joined: 24/05/2010 Posts: 1,761 Points: 5,351 Location: London & Greece
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I think I see it now. The jig is not meant for drawing the port but just for measuring.
Sorry for the false alarm.
John
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Rank: Elite Groups: Unapproved
Joined: 24/05/2010 Posts: 1,761 Points: 5,351 Location: London & Greece
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Sad day today as I go back to the UK and leave the lady behind for 3 months so no more complaints about the issues being 2 days late please. I thought I would put the latest pics up and as usual any advice would be very welcome (apart from - remove all the planks and start again). In the meantime I'll continue with the forum except when I'm abroad, and watch you all get further ahead but no problem. The last rib is flat to the keel but there is a bit of a curve, hope that's ok. As I mentioned previously I got into all sorts of contortions because of not using the pins and the planking is not as good as I would have liked but hopefully won't look to bad with a good rub down. I was hoping to get the middle gun ports all cut out before I left but ran out of time. Will now have to relearn all the knife skills. I couldn't get the template to line up with the bottom plank and the rib correctly and on top of that one of the planks broke while the glue was drying so I decided not to cut them until I had finished. Not sure if that is a good idea or not. Looking at some of the pics in the official build it seems the gallery will cover everything up though. Yes the dummy cannon positions are a bit out but they don't actually look to bad with kebab sticks in the ports as I couldn't resist see what the effect looked like. A good shot of the extra packing required for rib 12 here. All seems OK now but I guess I will know at some stage for sure. So final question, I am keen to do the lower planking now so that I can turn the ship over without too much damage to the work done already. I will then finish rows 13 and above after that together with the upper deck gun ports. Can anyone say if this would cause a problem later? So there we are. Good building to everyone and more pics in a while. John
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Rank: Elite Groups: Unapproved
Joined: 24/05/2010 Posts: 1,761 Points: 5,351 Location: London & Greece
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I think this may have got lost in the noise but I would still be interested in an answer especially from Tommic, thanks.
So final question, I am keen to do the lower planking now so that I can turn the ship over without too much damage to the work done already. I will then finish rows 13 and above after that together with the upper deck gun ports.
Can anyone say if this would cause a problem later?
John
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Rank: Pro Groups: Joined: 24/08/2009 Posts: 48,827 Points: -13,348
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As my build is by the book I can only comment if your building by the book if that makes sense, otherwise its departing from the intended build, where should anything go wrong it would be down to you to resolve.
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Rank: Elite Groups: Unapproved
Joined: 24/05/2010 Posts: 1,761 Points: 5,351 Location: London & Greece
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Yes it does make sense and I understand your position, thanks.
Thoughts from experts here most welcome.
John
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Rank: Pro Groups: Joined: 24/08/2009 Posts: 48,827 Points: -13,348
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What I will say is that if you turn over now then there is high risk of breaking the frame tops, where if these are first planked they will be supported.
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Rank: Master Groups: Registered
Joined: 15/04/2010 Posts: 1,266 Points: 3,841 Location: The Quantock Hills,Somerset
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Should be ok,Son of Bulwark did the same.just make sure you protect the ribs from bending & snapping as they are very vulnerable upside down...make a jig or something that supports the hull with the ribs off the ground.I made one that is working nicely..see post 16 & scroll the pics http://forum.model-space...t.aspx?g=posts&t=726Rob Nolli Illigitimi Carborundum!!!Current Builds: HMS Victory, SV Thermopylae
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Rank: Elite Groups: Unapproved
Joined: 24/05/2010 Posts: 1,761 Points: 5,351 Location: London & Greece
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Thanks. Yes I have a jig which I used to do the fairing on the main hull when the ship had to be upside down.
John
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Rank: Pro Groups: Joined: 24/08/2009 Posts: 48,827 Points: -13,348
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Hi John It's not a problem to stop at the upper gun deck then start the lower hull just make some blocks from MDF and bolt them together and fix to your jig with brackets. This will support the ship will you work on the bottom, make sure the blocks are bigger than the tallest ribs. I found fitting the upper deck easy when the hull isn't complete you can get in between the ribs to fit the deck beams & planks. Link to this section in my build diary :- http://forum.model-space...s&m=19902#post19902
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Rank: Elite Groups: Unapproved
Joined: 24/05/2010 Posts: 1,761 Points: 5,351 Location: London & Greece
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Thanks Darron, I will move ahead on that basis and if I cock up it's all your fault.
John
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Rank: Pro Groups: Joined: 24/08/2009 Posts: 48,827 Points: -13,348
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Well that's nice John! so if you cock up it's all my fault !That will teach me for giving you a little advice on how you can do thing's. Still you need to have someone to blame when thing's go wrong don't you! Make sure that when you support the ribs that the supports are not fixed to the base of your jig until you have bolted them to the ribs, or you might bend them if you first fix the support to the jig and then try to bolt the supports. I would use 3 or 4 sets of blocks to support the ribs, fit the MDF on each side of the ribs, bolts on the outside of the ribs, the brackets are at the end of the blocks to give you the most stable support. You might want put a pad between the support and the hull planks just to be safe. Have fun doing the lower hull planking!
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Rank: Elite Groups: Unapproved
Joined: 24/05/2010 Posts: 1,761 Points: 5,351 Location: London & Greece
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Son of Bulwark wrote:Well that's nice John! so if you cock up it's all my fault !That will teach me for giving you a little advice on how you can do thing's. Still you need to have someone to blame when thing's go wrong don't you! Definitely. Son of Bulwark wrote:Make sure that when you support the ribs that the supports are not fixed to the base of your jig until you have bolted them to the ribs, or you might bend them if you first fix the support to the jig and then try to bolt the supports. I would use 3 or 4 sets of blocks to support the ribs, fit the MDF on each side of the ribs, bolts on the outside of the ribs, the brackets are at the end of the blocks to give you the most stable support. You might want put a pad between the support and the hull planks just to be safe. Great stuff, thanks. Looks like I'll be busy over the whole of Summer. John
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Rank: Elite Groups: Unapproved
Joined: 24/05/2010 Posts: 1,761 Points: 5,351 Location: London & Greece
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I need a little help in the form of a favour from someone. I have decided to put together a new jig to use while I plank the lower hull however, I am in the UK for 3 months and my build is in Greece so I need some measurements taken. Here they are and as usual, any other tips very gratefully received.
1. What is the height from row 12 of the planking to the top of rib/frame 15
2. What is the height from row 12 of the planking to the top of rib/frame 26
3. What is the distance between ribs 15 and rib 26
4. What is the width of the ship at the top of rib 15 i.e., distance between the tops of the same rib across the beam
5. What is the width of the ship at the tops of rib 26
I might need some more as I go.
Many thanks.
John
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