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Nelson Speak: Everyday words from the time of Nelson's Navy Options
Plymouth57
#41 Posted : 24 August 2013 20:15:27

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Hi Jase

That's exactly what I thought too and if we stick to the 'proper' meaning of the Jack part it is the true definition of the Union Jack. The term had become so common by the beginning of the 20th Cent that the 'etiquette' of calling the national flag the Union Jack was decided in parliamentary discussion with the result that it can be called by that name in any location that its flown from.
So today, although the Union Jack is only flown from the Jack Staff on a RN warship, the WAG's and kids waving goodbye as she sails away are waving little paper union jacks!
Ruddy confusing! But Parliament says so and Parliament is never wrong!!Blink Blink Blink (SHH! they're watching everything you know!!BigGrin )

Robin
First wooden ship: The Grimsby 12 Gun 'Frigate' by Constructo Second: Bounty DelPrado Part Works Third: HMS Victory DelPrado Part Works 1/100 scale
Diorama of the Battle of the Brandywine from the American Revolutionary War Diorama of the Battle of New Falkland (unfinished sci-fi), Great War Centenary Diorama of the Messines Ridge Assault
Index for the Victory diary is on page 1
Plymouth57
#42 Posted : 29 August 2013 18:50:00

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OK then, here we go again! BigGrin

Chock-a-Block
Modern meaning: To be filled to capacity as in ‘no more could be fitted in the hold, it was chock a block with barrels down there!

This phrase has become slightly altered over the years, today, the phrase means the condition of something being completely filled up (which also means that the task of filling that something was finished). In Nelson’s day however, it was the other way around, that the task itself was completed because it could go no further.
This very subtle change comes from associating the phrase with tasks for which it was never intended! The ‘Block’ in the phrase is actually one of the wooden blocks used in the block and tackle found all over the sailing ship.
The task itself was one of hauling, ie, pulling on a rope in order to raise or lift an object such as taking in the sails or lifting up one of the ship’s boats to swing it over the side. On Victory the largest such block and tackle arrangements are found beneath the fighting platforms where they are used to raise and lower the yards from which the sails are hung but the best example to use for this description must be the blocks fixed to the catsheads to raise or ‘weigh’ the huge anchors.
At the beginning of the procedure the anchor is raised from the sea bed by the huge rope cables which are pulled up by the traveller, nippers and the main capstan (see “The Bitter End”). When the anchor breaks the surface, the anchor ring was hooked onto the wooden block slung down from the catshead in an operation called “Catting the Anchor”. At this point, the four lengths of rope forming the catshead tackle go all the way from the catshead up at deck level on the bow, right down to the block and anchor at sea level. The weight of the anchor is now supported by the catshead tackle and not the anchor cable as it was before. The end of this tackle was then pulled inboard, raising the anchor up to the level of the catshead and when the wooden block touched the catshead it could go no further and that task was completed. When two blocks touched (or in this example the block and the catshead itself) they were said to be ‘choc-a-block’ and the job was done. Originally (back in the time of the SOTS) the phrase was ‘block-a-block’ but it seems to have evolved over the centuries to become choc instead. So the phrase itself has changed since 1805, instead of meaning the job is over because the blocks cannot get any closer, it now means simply that nothing more can be added, similar, but a subtle difference!

Toe the Line (or Toeing the line)
Modern meaning: Very similar to the original, keeping to the rules or obeying the regulations.
Unlike many of the phrases here which are based on actions at sea or else on physical objects on the ship, this one is based on both! When any action involving the entire crew took place, in order to keep the hands under control they were made to stand in a particular location (usually at arms length from the Officers!) Such an event might be the regular payment of the crew’s wages when their names would be ticked off in the ship’s books as each man received his money. The ‘line’ in question might be an actual painted line on the deck or often it was just a designated caulking line on the deck planking. The crew would line up in order of seniority with their toes touching the line, each one waiting to be called up in turn to a small trestle table where the Officers and more importantly, the Purser would be waiting to give them their wages in return for a signature or ‘mark’ in the book. The phrase thereafter came to mean any group of persons obeying the rules under the scrutiny of their superiors.

Glossary:

Hauling: The act of pulling on a length of rope to raise some object up.
Weigh the Anchor: Raising the anchor up from the sea bed by means of the capstans and cables.
Catshead: One of two strong beams projecting out from the bows and used for securing the main anchor for sailing and also to drop it back in the sea clear of the hull.
Purser: A warrant Officer responsible for keeping track of the loading and usage of most of the stores brought on board and also for the paying of the crew’s wages amongst other things. The Purser was the ship’s ‘Accountant’, there were two types of ship’s pursers – good ones and rich ones!
Blink
First wooden ship: The Grimsby 12 Gun 'Frigate' by Constructo Second: Bounty DelPrado Part Works Third: HMS Victory DelPrado Part Works 1/100 scale
Diorama of the Battle of the Brandywine from the American Revolutionary War Diorama of the Battle of New Falkland (unfinished sci-fi), Great War Centenary Diorama of the Messines Ridge Assault
Index for the Victory diary is on page 1
jase
#43 Posted : 29 August 2013 19:18:46

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Plymouth57 wrote:
Hi Jase

That's exactly what I thought too and if we stick to the 'proper' meaning of the Jack part it is the true definition of the Union Jack. The term had become so common by the beginning of the 20th Cent that the 'etiquette' of calling the national flag the Union Jack was decided in parliamentary discussion with the result that it can be called by that name in any location that its flown from.
So today, although the Union Jack is only flown from the Jack Staff on a RN warship, the WAG's and kids waving goodbye as she sails away are waving little paper union jacks!
Ruddy confusing! But Parliament says so and Parliament is never wrong!!Blink Blink Blink (SHH! they're watching everything you know!!BigGrin )

Robin


Hi Plymouth

Well I have lernt something there!! don't let the wife know I have been correcting her for years LOL LOL LOL
“Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.”
-Mark Twain
Plymouth57
#44 Posted : 27 September 2013 19:23:25

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Hi All, I've been too long so here's the next couple! Blushing

Waster
Modern meaning: A worthless or second rate individual, something along the lines of a benefits cheat or other scrounger.
This word is one of my favourites as it basically means much the same as the original but the spelling has subtly changed and the original of Nelson’s day had absolutely nothing to do with waste!
In actual fact, the modern definition is somewhat harsher than the original, it didn’t mean a person who was the dregs of society, it was simply a slightly derogatory label for a second rate sailor. Seamen were ‘rated’ according to their abilities and experience. Those with no experience were regarded as “Lubbers” (Land Lubber for example) after them came the common Seaman followed by those with sufficient training to perform most but not all the duties on a Man o’ War the Able Seaman. The very best of them would eventually become the elite of sailors; the Topmen, those qualified to work aloft in the masts and rigging. To the Topman, everyone else was, in his eyes below him (quite literally in most cases) and those not qualified to work along side him were relegated to the gun crews who worked in the waist area of the ship, this is where the subtle spelling change came about, his inferiors were not WASTERS but WAISTERS. Over time, the word remained the same verbally, but the spelling changed to represent a person who was a “waste” of space and not just a lower rank of seaman.

Bilge or ‘Utter Bilge’
Modern meaning: Information or some other verbal correspondence which the listener regards as completely untrustworthy. For example, “He gave an excuse which was utter bilge as far as I’m concerned!”
No ship is ever completely water tight, especially those constructed of wood. Wood decays and rots, it shrinks when dry and is attacked by many marine invertebrates. The only good thing about it is that it floats – mostly!
Because of all of the above, there is a constant leakage of water into the hull of a Man o’ War. This water finds its way down through the many decks until it finds its way into the lowest part of the internal structure of the vessel – the Bilge. Those of you who have a copy of the Alan McGowan Victory book can find an excellent drawing of the bilges on page 207 “The Chain Pumps”. The Bilges consist of two channels, one either side of the keel, (more accurately the Keelson), to the fore and aft of the main mast. The water that collects here is by definition Foul! It would be stinking of tannin leached out of the ship’s timbers, urine, dead rats and God knows what else on top of being simply stale sea water, it was a part of the ship that no seaman would want to visit out of choice! The foul Bilge-Water was pumped out by the Chain Pumps situated two decks above on the lower gun deck. The chain pumps operated on the bicycle chain principle, each of the four separate pumps having a square wooden pipe through which the chain passed around an axle in the bilge and a vertical capstan at the top. This capstan could be fitted with an extension handle much like the old car engine starting handle with up to thirty men turning it. The port and starboard pumps were linked on the same axle so the pumps were operated either two or all four at a time so with the extensions in place and all four pumps going one hundred and twenty of the crew were occupied drawing up one hundred and twenty tons of water per hour. This foul, stinking water exited the pumps through a square outlet, in an emergency straight onto the lower gun deck, (not very nice for anybody who had to hook their hammock up down there!) but in normal use into canvas hoses which were run across the deck to outlets set in the hull walls. The Bilge-Water was so foul that any excuse or explanation that a seaman heard and didn’t ring true stank like ‘Bilge-Water’, and later, just ‘Bilge’. (Also, operating those chain pumps was one of the most exhausting tasks the seaman could face, look at the effort it took in the Master and Commander film when they were pumping out the battle damage water from the hull!)Blink

Glossary:
Lubber: A derogatory term for anyone without any sailing experience. Often called a Land Lubber. On the shrouds, which carry the Ratlines up to the fighting tops, a few feet below the tops there are a series of overhanging ratlines from the shrouds to the outer edges of the tops. The shrouds themselves carry on up through a rectangular hole to the mast itself. This hole is called the Lubber’s Hole and any seaman who used that to reach the tops would earn the undying contempt of his companions who climbed up the outside edge!
Waist: The central area of the ship below the skid beams where the ship’s boats were stored. The most untrained of the crew were stationed here.
Bilge: The lowest part of the internal structure of the ship, a sort of drainage point for the ship’s pumps
Chain Pump: A more efficient manually operated water pump designed to draw up the foul water from the bilges. The earlier version was the Elm Tree Pump with cylindrical tubes made by boring out a complete Elm tree trunk (Elm was found to have a better resistance to sea water than Oak but lacked the strength for ships hulls) Elm tree pumps also went through the actual bottom of the hull to pump up sea water for fire fighting.
First wooden ship: The Grimsby 12 Gun 'Frigate' by Constructo Second: Bounty DelPrado Part Works Third: HMS Victory DelPrado Part Works 1/100 scale
Diorama of the Battle of the Brandywine from the American Revolutionary War Diorama of the Battle of New Falkland (unfinished sci-fi), Great War Centenary Diorama of the Messines Ridge Assault
Index for the Victory diary is on page 1
Plymouth57
#45 Posted : 13 October 2013 21:05:47

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Found some more!

Scuttlebutt
Modern meaning: Rumours or gossip of a military, especially naval nature.
I am forced to admit that I have long known of this phrase, but had deliberately omitted it from this list, as I had always believed that it was an American Navy phrase. The only reason for this was that I had only ever heard it mentioned on American TV and films, mostly on WW2 War Movies and lately on the NCIS Drama series. I have now discovered that NO! the Yanks did NOT invent the word after all! WE invented it way back in Nelson’s time and its just one of the many things which actually originated over here and were simply adopted (the nicer way of saying stolen!) by ‘them over there!’
If you have any of the many reference books on the Victory (see my other thread for two of the best), take a look at the drawings of the gun port lids, on the lower two gun decks, (those without direct access to day light and fresh air) you will find that the lids not only open and close themselves, they have a small oval or rectangular opening set in their upper halves. This little opening has it’s own hinged door and is, in effect, a closable air vent to allow fresh air into the lower decks without opening the main lid and drenching the crew in rough seas. This little hole is called the “Scuttle”
Now for the Butt! On tropical stations, the Captain would allow a water butt to be kept on the main deck from which the duty watch members could slake their thirst. There were two ways they could drink from this butt, some Officers would provide an old musket barrel which was stuck through a hole drilled into the butt lid and any of the crew could drink as much as he could suck up through the metal barrel ‘straw’. The more usual method however, was to provide a tin mug which could be filled by dipping it into a square hole cut into the butt. The seaman could drink two mug-fulls at any one time but no more! Because the water barrel (or Butt) had a square hole (another Scuttle) cut into it, it was known as the “Scuttlebutt”. This barrel became a good place to congregate whilst the men lined up for a drink and to have a good yarn or gossip whilst they waited. In time the actual gossip took on the term of the location it took place in – the ‘Scuttlebutt’!

I’ll eat my Hat!
Modern meaning: I’ll do something drastic if I’m proved wrong!
This is one of Nelson’s phrases, which has changed completely from its original form. In Nelson’s time, his seamen really did ‘eat’ their hats! In some respects, the sense of something going wrong was part of the original meaning though. As well as their pipes, seamen also enjoyed another form of nicotine addiction – chewing tobacco. The men would keep their long lasting wads of chewing ‘baccy’ with them at all times, chewing away at it during their duties and long watches and secreting it into the linings of their straw boater hats when they slept. Eventually, even British Navy issue tobacco would be chewed to death and for the seaman, desperate for his ‘fix’, it was not unknown for him to remove the cotton lining from his hat which was, by this time liberally soaked with tobacco juice and chew on that instead. So for Jolly Jack Tar, when things went really bad (running out of tobacco for instance) he would literally ‘eat his hat!’

Glossary:
Scuttle: A small opening, usually rectangular or oval in shape, set into a larger object. Whether ‘scuttling a ship’ involved opening scuttles set into the hull for that purpose I don’t know, but it sounds plausible!
Butt: Another name for a wooden barrel, (mostly for the larger varieties)
Baccy: A term used for tobacco.
Boater: The short squat looking hat, mainly made of straw which was part of the British seaman’s uniform. The term possibly came from the smartest members of the crew who formed the boat crew for the Captain’s launch.

First wooden ship: The Grimsby 12 Gun 'Frigate' by Constructo Second: Bounty DelPrado Part Works Third: HMS Victory DelPrado Part Works 1/100 scale
Diorama of the Battle of the Brandywine from the American Revolutionary War Diorama of the Battle of New Falkland (unfinished sci-fi), Great War Centenary Diorama of the Messines Ridge Assault
Index for the Victory diary is on page 1
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