the forecastle bulwarks were shoulder high at trafalgar and not knee high as she is now, I believe this kit has the knee high ones, the only model I know of that includes the high bulwarks is the jotika

Do I see storm clouds on the horizon?

I most sincerely hope not David.

My concern is that we are all investing heavily in this project and I would hate to think that any models are spoilt by members of the forum being mislead by a seemingly factual statement which is unsubstantiated. Anything I have contributed to the forum has been based on at least one or another respected source and the origin quoted.

Mike T

I completely agree Mike, and I for one am grateful for your efforts

I have to admit that I have come across this claim about the bulwarks being at shoulder height before. It was on another modelers website and curiously enough came up in a thread that was talking about the non existence of the Victory's entry ports on the Heller model. Sound familiar doesn't it.

In the post he mentions that it was "now pretty widely accepted" that the bulwarks were shoulder high but I can find no reference to this claim anywhere else other than that website so I will remain sceptical until more credible evidence is forth coming.

If you are interested the thread can be found here and is the sixth post down, fifth paragraph.

heres the quote dtgray

Mr. Bugler figured out, way back in the 1920s or thereabouts, that they'd been raised to shoulder height during the ship's last refit before Trafalgar. Dr. Anderson, who was in charge of the actual restoration, found out about that (as he acknowledged, quite handsomely and publicly, when Mr. Bugler's book was published a few years later) shortly after the carpenters had finished fabricating the knee-high, rail-and-timberhead arrangement that's on her forecastle today. Having spent a great deal of money getting that work completed, Dr. Anderson was (quite understandably, in view of the scarcity of funds for such things) reluctant to order it torn apart and replaced.

now bugler`s book cost`t over £200, and its only in three liberies, in the country,

now jotika used to supply a portsmouth conversion kit, and because of feedback stopped including it, and on some forum somewhere a customer emailed jotika to ask where the portsmouth conversion kit was, and this is the reply he got from them.

The 'Portsmouth Pack' is a separate bag of extra pieces and instructions providing everything required to build the forecastle bulwarks with timberheads, as Victory is currently in Portsmouth, rather than the solid bulwarks, as Victory was at Trafalgar. This pack was included in all of the kits sold for the first year or so of production however, feedback from customers and photos we have received showed that approximately 1 in every 25 people only were choosing to build the kit to the 'Portsmouth' configuration, as a result we chose to remove the Portsmouth Pack from the kits. The pack is still available to customers free of charge should they wish to build to the Portsmouth configuration, all we require is the kit serial number to confirm it has been registered.

If it is your intention to build Victory to the Portsmouth configuration, please let me know and I will get a pack off to you. If you are building Victory to the 1805 Trafalgar specification then there is no need for this pack.

Sincerely
Richard Wright

JoTiKa Ltd.


so richard wright acually put in print, that the shoulder high bulwark were there at tragalgar, and jokita`s model is the latest on the market using the most recent research.

to be honest mike t, these people on this forum are not children, can you stop please jumping in with both feet, its a forum, not what mike t says, and also provoking you can only draw you into declairing what you know on the matter which is apparently nowt. how can you possibly agree with the block model`s reference when it was you who condemned it

Do I HAVE to bring the kitten out again?

That sounds great Mike, thanks

Oh my, I kinda feel a bit important like, excusing ignorance

I have no idea why you think that members can ambush my thread, and do their best to ridicule me without any retribution. if you read the whole thread, which is mine you can see how it was ignorantly ambushed.


hence I excuse their ignoranc
but if you think that blatant ignorance is fine well you will find yourself in good company on this forum